Ten Commandments "Basis of Our Laws" Position

[Mike Schutt]

Of course it would follow, to Christians and Jews alike, that the entire
Torah comes from outside humankind.  The uniqueness of the Ten
Commandments is that it is their "giving" is conveyed by a narrative
demonstration of that fact, because, in the Scripture passage, God
literally writes the Ten Commandments.  Again, if the Ten Commandments
are a summary of the entire moral, religious, and civil law, the Torah
is also from outside humankind.  
 
The Ten Commandments are only unique in the sense that Scripture relates
their giving in a dramatic way.    
 
-----Original Message-----
From: religionlaw-bounces at lists.ucla.edu
[mailto:religionlaw-bounces at lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of A.E. Brownstein
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 1:11 PM
To: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics
Subject: Re: Ten Commandments "Basis of Our Laws" Position


When Mike writes that "The Ten Commandments is a stark (if not the first
surviving) demonstration that law comes from "outside" humankind-- that
is, that law is not merely a human artifact," he is expressing a
position with significant sectarian implications. For traditional Jews,
the entire Torah is law that "comes from 'outside' humankind." The
contention that the Ten Commandments is unique in this regard is a
position on which Jews and Christians seriously disagree. 

If Mike is correct that this is the sense in which the statement that
"the Ten Commandments is the basis for our laws is meant", it would seem
to be an explicitly faith specific religious idea.

Alan Brownstein
UC Davis








At 11:21 AM 12/16/2004 -0600, you wrote:


In response to Ed's and Prof Lipkin's post, just a quick thought or two.

 
I think what is traditionally meant by the "basis of our laws" position
is the following:
 
1.  The Ten Commandments is a stark (if not the first surviving)
demonstration that law comes from "outside" humankind-- that is, that
law is not merely a human artifact.  This has a long tradition in the
common law, from Magna Carta, to Coke, to Bracton and Blackstone.  The
ten commandments "are the basis of our laws," then, in the sense that
the common law has taken the view that the King us under law, because
law comes from God.  Russell Kirk in his Roots of American Order, for
example, cites the giving of the ten commandments as the foundation of
Western order.  So, first, the position is that the fact that the Ten
Commandments were from God, not man (being written with the finger of
God) are the basis for many of the fundamental common law propositions,
beginning with "no man is above the law."  
 
2.  Theologians, including Augustine and Calvin and many other
Protestant and Catholic theologians in the history of the West have made
direct connection between the Ten Commandments and *all* civil, moral,
and ceremonial law.  Therefore, "all law" in a sense is based on or--
maybe this is better put-- summarized by the Ten.  This is a pretty
supportable proposition from the Old and New Testaments.  So even laws
that should not be civil laws, such as the ones that Ed points out, are
still "law" in the sense of moral law, as Ed also points out.
Furthermore, civil laws should be based on, modeled after, and in
conformance with the moral law; so in that sense, our civil laws are
"based on the Ten Commandments."  
 
I can't speak for everyone who might use the phrase, but this is my
understanding of what it means to say that "our laws" are based on the
"Ten Commandments."  
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: religionlaw-bounces at lists.ucla.edu
[mailto:religionlaw-bounces at lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of
RJLipkin at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 10:01 AM
To: religionlaw at lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Steven Williams case and the Ten Commandments cases

        I want to second Ed Braton's thoughtful post, and inquire of
anyone who knows whether the laws, rules, customs of the Jews prior to
the acquisition of the Ten Commandments included prohibitions against
murder and theft, for example.  If the answer is yes then all those who
agree with Robert Bork's remark, and I'm paraphrasing perhaps
unfaithfully, that liberal society lives off the moral capital of the
Judeo-Christian religious tradition are historically inaccurate. Indeed,
it opens up the anthropological question whether the Judeo-Christian
religious tradition lives off the moral capital of prior secular
societies if any existed, or prior pagan societies.
 
Bobby
 
Robert Justin Lipkin
Professor of Law
Widener University School of Law
Delaware
 
 
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