[Oradlist] Pantomographic unit

Tue Sep 23 15:43:28 PDT 2008

Lisa: If you respectfully beg to differ does this mean that you think
the issues of potential, apparent and probable conflict of interest are
not matters of any importance when it comes to recommendations made on
the ORADLIST? ... And you believe that I have no right to bring up this
matter? I made my reflections as I knew without any doubt that at least
three of the individuals who had made recommendations had at one time a
close association with the vendor recommended. Thank you for
acknowledging your own association so clearly. That is all I requested!
Best personal wishes, Allan

Allan G. Farman, BDS, PhD, MBA, DSc, Diplomate ABOMR

Prof. Radiology & Imaging Science
Univ. Louisville School of Dentistry: SUHD
501 South Preston Street,
Louisville, Kentucky 40292, USA 

Tel: +1(502) 852.1241
Fax: +1(502)852.1626

>>> "Koenig, Lisa" <lisa.koenig at marquette.edu> 09/23/2008 06:11 PM >>>
Allan,  I respectfully beg to differ.  When you write comments to
Andres like " I was not referring to you but to others who responded who
I
know personally and happen to be able to associate with more cosy
relations to the vendor concerned" you are definitely directing
comments at individuals. Me thinks "the gentleman doth protest too
much".  Now go to sleep and wake up on the right side of the bed
tomorrow :-) Best Wishes, Lisa

Lisa J. Koenig BChD, DDS, MS
Program Director, Oral Medicine and Oral Radiology
Marquette University School of Dentistry, Rm: 370
PO Box 1881
Milwaukee, WI 53201-1881
Tel: (414) 288-5675
Fax: (414) 288-6081

-----Original Message-----
From: oradlist-bounces at lists.ucla.edu
[mailto:oradlist-bounces at lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of Allan G Farman
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 3:14 PM
To: 'Oral Radiology Discussion Group'
Subject: Re: [Oradlist] Pantomographic unit

Dear Lisa: I was very specifically not directing the comments at
individuals, but rather extending the concept that perhaps conflicts
of
interest should be posted alongside recommendations when using
ORADLIST.
My comments were meant to stir dialog on the proper format, if any,
for
providing endorsements on ORADLIST. Should any one of the
recommendations have been placed alone, or in combination with a mix
representing multiple vendors, then I would most probably not have
raised the issue. It so happened that there were four endorsements of
the same product and none of these were accompanied by
details/specifications or high levels of evidence... and nobody
indicate
that Instrumentarium employed them to promote their product in Latin
America, to develop advertising/educational brochures, or to  test new
systems at a conveniently situated University. All of these activities
are valid and I also participate in helping industry from time to time
in similar manners.  Instrumentarium has supplied equipment used in my
institution and has funded graduate student research without
restriction
on publication of results. They are a good company, but not the only
good company and not the only one to produce excellent panoramic
systems.

I am happy that you will participate in the ADA activity next month.
In
that circumstance, you are employed by Soredex to represent their
product as others will be employed by the other 5 vendors in a similar
capacity and that will be well understood by the audience who get to
compare the units of multiple vendors, side by side and also in
association with other vendors providing third party services in their
presentations at the ADA interoperability booth. I will be acting as a
ring master of a 7 ring circus and in ensuring that the bounds of
safety
and ADA CERP requirements are not crossed. The companies are
participating with some hope to give visibility to their products. I
am
participating with a hope to promote and demonstrate the use of
standards in dentistry.

Best wishes from FDI Stockholm where I speak tomorrow and one of my
first slides is a list of interactions with ind
ustry that could
(possibly subliminally) affect my viewpoints,
Allan

Allan G. Farman, BDS, PhD, MBA, DSc, Diplomate ABOMR

Prof. Radiology & Imaging Science
Univ. Louisville School of Dentistry: SUHD
501 South Preston Street,
Louisville, Kentucky 40292, USA

Tel: +1(502) 852.1241
Fax: +1(502)852.1626

>>> "Koenig, Lisa" <lisa.koenig at marquette.edu> 09/23/2008 12:33 PM >>>
Allan,  I guess I am included in the "others" who you believe to be
"cosy" with Instrumentarium.  Instrumentarium is located in Milwaukee
and I will be demonstrating the Scanora 3D machine at the ADA meeting
in
October.  Other than that I have no financial interest in the company.
I believe that you will also be part of the presentations at the ADA
in
regards to the DICOM format of the images produced by CBCT machines in
general.  I do not believe this connection precludes me from
expressing
an opinion on the quality of the images from the OP200D in comparison
to
other machines that I have used.  Time did, however, preclude me from
writing a lengthy explanation.  I agree with Dr. Briner that the
purpose
of this discussion group is to share our opinions and help our
colleagues when we can.  And, I truly believe that comments on the
OradList from humble academicians such as me are made in good faith
and
not because of some monetary incentive.  Obviously we are professional
people and any comments made on any website have to be carefully
evaluated.  I think we can allow the individual to do that for
themselves though.    Lisa

Lisa J. Koenig BChD, DDS, MS
Program Director, Oral Medicine and Oral Radiology
Marquette University School of Dentistry, Rm: 370
PO Box 1881
Milwaukee, WI 53201-1881
Tel: (414) 288-5675
Fax: (414) 288-6081
-----Original Message-----
From: oradlist-bounces at lists.ucla.edu 
[mailto:oradlist-bounces@
lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of Allan G Farman
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 5:32 AM
To: Oral Radiology Discussion Group
Subject: Re: [Oradlist] Pantomographic unit

Andres... I was not referring to you but to others who responded who I
know personally and happen to be able to associate with more cosy
relations to the vendor concerned. I also have no problem with
Instrumentarium or their products which are excellent... but then I
too
have consulted for Instrumentarium in the past.  It was the use of the
ORADLIST blog by a number of individuals in succession to highlight
merely one vendor's product without any reflection to other products
and
without the caveat that you now supply that I found questionable. I
would like the individuals supporting a product to indicate any
conflicts of interest in the same manner they would be expected to do
prior to giving a continuing education lecture at a congress... and to
more precisely specify the rationales for their endorsements. Best
wishes, Allan

Allan G. Farman, BDS, PhD, MBA, DSc, Diplomate ABOMR

Prof. Radiology & Imaging Science
Univ. Louisville School of Dentistry: SUHD
501 South Preston Street,
Louisville, Kentucky 40292, USA

Tel: +1(502) 852.1241
Fax: +1(502)852.1626

>>> "Andrés Briner" <andresbriner at gmail.com> 09/22/2008 08:26 PM >>>
Dear Professor Farman
It is  important to me to state clearly that I have absolutely no
relation
in any possible way with Instrumentarium except that I work in 2
private clinics dedicated to DMFR and 2 hospitals, using  in total 3
OP
100
and 2 OP 200 Digital units from Instrumentarium.   The only I said is
about
the image quality of those equipments, and I agree with you, that
there
are
others factors that have to be considered in the moment to choose a
particular brand, but sincerely I don't fill comfortable with your
comment
about at least 3 of the respondents have some relation with the
company,
because in my case, this is not true.      I have not signed my email
as an
expert, it is an humble and honest opinion coming from a colleague
from
a
far country.  I think we will help in a better way our colleague Dr.
Rampa
Ganguluy giving him choices and
 arguments to make the best possible
choice,
If not, what for is this discussion group?.

Sincerely

Dr. Andres Briner
IMAX radiological centres
Santiago
Chile

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 4:03 PM, Allan G Farman
<agfarm01 at louisville.edu>wrote:

> I have read with great concern the communications related to your
seemingly
> simple request. To date you have had a single recommendation with a
single
> example image provided - and at least three of the respondents to my
> knowledge have provided consulting services or even in one case has
even
> been tantamount to a salesman for the unit concerned. This is not a
> criticism of the Instrumentarium Imaging panoramic system, which I
have also
> had excellent experience in using; it is rather a criticism of the
use of
> this blog to provide apparently "expert" opinion with no need to
reference a
> scientific study or provide actual comparisons of relevant clinical
> information to support the recommendations made.
>
> When making a purchasing decision I would advise anyone to be
extremely
> careful of the information received from a "blog.' There are
actually
many
> excellent panoramic systems on the market at this time ad the choice
is
> quite complex dependent on the type of clinic, type of patient, type
of
> procedure, local support provided by a given vendor, budget, and
desired
> recording medium plus details of interoperability of digital systems
with
> the practice management system of the buyer. I obviously cannot talk
about
> systems that I have not used, but in addition to Instrumentarium, I
have
> also had excellent experience with Kodak Dental Imaging, Planmeca,
and
> Sirona systems at the medium to upper end of the market and have
also
> produced excellent images even with an inexpensive Panoramic
Corporation PC
> 1000 when
equipped with an AJAT digital sensor capable of permitting
> after-the-fact adjustment of the image layer. There
 are undoubtedly
several
> solutions and the one that is best will d!
>  epemd on a multitude of inputs concerning the clinical needs
circumstances
> involved.
>
> AGF
>
> Allan G. Farman, BDS, PhD, MBA, DSc, Diplomate ABOMR
>
> Prof. Radiology & Imaging Science
> Univ. Louisville School of Dentistry: SUHD
> 501 South Preston Street,
> Louisville, Kentucky 40292, USA
>
> Tel: +1(502) 852.1241
> Fax: +1(502)852.1626
>
>
> >>> "Rumpa Ganguly" <gangulyrumpa at gmail.com> 09/21/2008 03:16 PM >>>
> Hi all,
>
> I am a third year resident in Oral & maxillofacial radiology at
UIowa. We
> need to purchase a pantomographic unit (digital) for one of our
> clinics in our school. I am reviewing all the possibilities that are
> available. Any suggestions on the available units and your
experience
with
> them would be helpful.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Rumpa Ganguly
> Chief Resident
> Oral and maxillofacial radiology
> College of dentistry, University of Iowa
>
>
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