The Word "Killing" (was Re: regret)

[Lynne Henderson]

RE: The Word "Killing" (was Re: regret)Actually, I have criticized the *Roe* Court's use of the term  a long time ago (*Legality and Empathy, 85 Mich. L. rev.)  I noted that the rhetoric implied only an evil mother would kill her child.  Thus, telling a woman she is killin gher child is cruel.  I don't think that's what Justice Blackmun meant, however.  

"Mother" tends to be associated with a role towards a born child, although I suppose a pregnant woman could be termed "a mother" (or "potential mother")

 I think Prof. Cohen's post on the term is very accurate:  A woman seeking to  end an unwanted pregnancy  has chosen not  to be a mother (at that time at least).  A  woman who wanted the child but has ot have an abortion for health reasons or because the fetus/unborn child is severely deformed or even dead is heartbroken because she won' tbe a mother (One of my friends had the latter experience, she was referred to an abortion clinic because they are the safest for the procedure, and she had to run a gantlet of protesters which made the experience even worse--she has thankfully had two healthy children since)

I prefer pregant woman since, as has been pointed out, the "pregnant persons" gets you into the unreality of *Geduldig*.
 
   As for the distinction between first trimester and second trimester abortions (yes, e do need those divisions--*Roe* wasn't wrong on that in terms of the procedures, concerns, and reasons) Prof. Johnsen is correct--particularly now tha twomen in many states have to go through waiting periods and travel long distances, and have to raise money if they are poor, they may be in the second trimester by the time the abortion is performed.
  
 Of course, during oral argument in *Roe,* one Justice asked  which life counsel would choose--"the innocent one or what" implying I guess all women are guilty and if they want or need an abortion, they are morally irresponsible and can be told by the State that they are under a broad reading of *Carhart II* and *Casey*.  (and assuming that children are innocent or not born into Original Sin or whath have you)
All this  leaves me convinced that the woman should be the one to make the decision whether or not to have a child and concerned about the government telling her under what circumstances and what conditions she may or may not make that decision a reality.
Respectfully,
Lynne Henderson
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Scaperlanda, Michael A. 
  To: Johnsen, Dawn Elizabeth ; Trevor Morrison ; Jonathan H. Adler ; conlawprof at lists.ucla.edu 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 9:25 AM
  Subject: RE: The Word "Killing" (was Re: regret)




  We are talking about second and third trimester abortions because that is what the Supreme Court was addressing in Carhart II.  If referring to the woman as "mother" is disrespectful, put that on the Roe Court, not me.  Is the Roe Court's motive "cruel and disrespectful?  How do you know? 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Johnsen, Dawn Elizabeth [mailto:djohnsen at indiana.edu]
  Sent: Tue 4/24/2007 9:59 AM
  To: Scaperlanda, Michael A.; Trevor Morrison; Jonathan H. Adler; conlawprof at lists.ucla.edu
  Subject: RE: The Word "Killing" (was Re: regret)


  At the risk of stating the obvious (but I feel it merits a reminder):  9 out of 10 abortions take place in the first trimester (and virtually none in the "eight or nearly ninth month"--so what is the point of that reference?); people feel very differently about abortion--including whether an abortion at, for eg, 6 weeks is a "tragedy"--and that is an essential point of leaving the decision to the individual (for many people it depends on the timing and circumstances); and whatever one's moral view of abortion, many (appropriately in my view) share the the goal of "safe, legal and less frequent" (I think "rare" is unrealistic) through comprehensive and accurate sex education programs, contraceptive availability, programs that support healthy pregnancy and childbearing (health care, living wage, etc.).  Telling a woman who has a first trimester abortion that she was a "mother" and has killed her unborn child in my view is cruel and  disrespectful, and the motive behind such language is obvious. 

  Dawn Johnsen

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