The Left and patriotism

[Volokh, Eugene]

	What am I missing here?  A Puerto Rican who wants to secede
(presumably because he sees Puerto Rico as culturally distinct enough
from the U.S. that it deserves self-government) may well be a patriotic
Puerto Rican; he's just not a patriotic American, and probably wouldn't
want to claim that he is.  A Californian who wants to secede (because
it's been a whole 6 years since California sentiment about the
Presidency has roughly matched the majority of the nation's sentiment)
may well be a patriotic Californian; I just find it hard to see why he's
a patriotic American.  (As to Barry Goldwater, might he have been . . .
joking?  Wouldn't the "sawed off" be something of a giveaway there?)

	Eugene

> -----Original Message-----
> From: conlawprof-bounces at lists.ucla.edu 
> [mailto:conlawprof-bounces at lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of John 
> Bonine (U of O)
> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 2:36 PM
> To: CONLAWPROF at lists.ucla.edu
> Subject: RE: The Left and patriotism
> 
> 
> Eugene, 
> 
> > 	Many on the Left quite properly bristle when others 
> suggest that 
> > they're unpatriotic.  . . .  One can oppose aspects of our 
> > Constitution
> and still be
> > patriotic.
> 
> I had a hard time getting past your first and third 
> sentences.  Maybe it's just me. 
> 
> This isn't a question of whether the Left opposes part of the 
> Constitution, is it?  Or is that your point?
> 
> Or did you mean to say simply that one can oppose some things 
> and still be patriotic, but cannot oppose reducing any part 
> of the territory and be patriotic?
> 
> Assuming the latter, Barry Goldwater was not patriotic when 
> he proposed that New York "be sawed off and allowed to drift 
> out to sea"?  A whole bunch of Westerners thought that he was 
> intensely patriotic.
> 
> And what about letting Puerto Rico go if it chooses?  
> Patriotic, not, or don't know?
> 
> Finally, what about encouraging some Americans to leave (you 
> know, "America, love it or leave it!" from the 1960s)?  
> Surely not patriotic at all, because to want some Americans 
> to leave would surely be as bad as wanting, say, New York to leave.
> 
> Now, about ADDING territory or Americans, I am still trying 
> to figure out what the patriotic position is on that.
> 
> John
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: conlawprof-bounces at lists.ucla.edu
> > [mailto:conlawprof-bounces at lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of 
> Volokh, Eugene
> > Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 1:43 PM
> > To: conlawprof at lists.ucla.edu
> > Subject: The Left and patriotism
> > 
> 
> 
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